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1/6 24/7!
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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I left 1/6 hobby for a long time because I started to collecting 1:1 stuff, during that time, I have gained knowledge in actual stuff. Recently I revisited 1:6 once again but now I cringed on one small problem: Accuracy.

I noticed that many 1/6 companies always make boxed figures or sets, while overall figures looks great and extremely well detailed, however, there are usually some errors. Some equipment is incorrect for what the figure was supposed to represent.

Bad research on manufacturer's part or was it intentional?

For instance, Hot toys made a pretty cool set: USAF Airman Security Forces, Iraq. It came with Improved Outer Tactical Vest (IOTV), as far I am concerned, USAF didn't get issued those at this time because it was Army issue. Based on many reference photos I've seen, all of them worn older OTV. So the OTV would be correct for this time frame. Beside Security Forces guys weren't even issued M26 shotgun to be mounted on their M4s, yet, this set has it.

And another example, Toy Soldier made a cool Vietnam War USMC Force Recon rifleman/corpsman, included in this set was a very nice M1967 web gear with USMC combat pack. One problem..... There were not one a photographic evidence of Force Recon with M1967 and let alone, USMC combat pack in Vietnam War. Marines were finally issued M1967 equipment during the evacuation of Embassy in 1975. Everyone knows that Marines were pretty slow with updating the equipment.

There were some photos of AFSOC guy with PCU, Tri-color desert cover on ACH, coyote brown RRV, and rocking a M-14 so Hot Toys copied exact set up but branded and sold it as Navy Seal VBSS - PCU Version. (There were some serious Hot Toys fan boys denied it).

One of my most favorite set from Hot Toys was Pararescue Jumper which had a badass ELCS rig set up. I would later realized that at that time frame, they used USGI issue FLC (Fighting Load Carrier), NOT Safariland ELCS. Beside it came with airsave body armor, while Pararescue may have used it, but I haven't seen any photos of them wearing it.

Those are just few of many examples.

But why? Because there were lack or insufficient of certain items in 1/6 so manufacturers decided to sacrifice the accuracy to meet demand of the 1/6 community by including certain items? Or to force hobbyists to buy the whole set just to get certain item so the company could get a profit?

What effect does it have on the 1/6 community? After paying hefty price, perfectionists like myself would have to buy some loose parts to make it right. The worst part is some collectors would be believe the boxed figure is accurate and even use it as a guideline to bash other figures.

Any thoughts?
 

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Proudly Banned by OSS
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Solution: A vet reached out to a company. The company agreed to make it. The vet supplied the pictures. The company talked to other people about getting 1:1 period-specific gear to be used as a reference. The company clarified with the vet about the specific rigging, use of equipment, and specific models of equipment that the vet used. When the vet had a question because the haze of time dulled memories, the company contacted other subject matter experts for help. The company used the photos as only one piece of a multi-source effort to understand how to create a figure true to this specific unit. When the company began prototyping, they continued to consulting with the vet, further refining their product until it was the... BEST DAMN X EVER MADE.
Now, how realistic does that sound? Seriously, what company would do that?
 

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OSW Admin staff
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This was actually discussed at length when one of the WWI figures was coming out, people who were actually involved in the project who had given 1:1 items to the makers in hopes of getting things right..and the company they still got it wrong...why?

Who knows...pride maybe, conflicting information, language barrier (since most of this stuff is made in Asian) communication break down between the company and the factory. Remember there are only a few factories that can make this stuff.

The figures you speak of the HT one is a pretty old figure so who knows what research they did for that one and HT no longer does military.

SS should get it right considering military is there bread and butter but again who knows..

This might help

http://www.onesixthwarriors.com/for.../734391-why-dont-they-make-___-explained.html
 

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1:6 Acquisitionist
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I appreciate & respect accuracy as much as the next collector, but nowadays I'm more focused on quality & price primarily since overall I believe accuracy & design overall are good, but I've never been an accuracy Nazi per say.
 

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IMOK
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I personally don't think this hobby is all about accuracy! I like that companies give a handful of gear that can be optional in use. As others have pointed out in the past, most people who collect military 1/6 will set up the figures exactly like the box. While there is no problem with that, others who are more into accuracy will customize and refine their figures and create something to their own satisfaction. I also think that you have to allow room for creative license! The few big companies offering us goods are in a huge predicament of over producing very similar product and themes as is. I for one am not the expert on gear and all that, but I am really starting to enjoy what I have learned already through collecting in this hobby. Not to mention all the great wealth of knowledge from this very site that keeps coming. I enjoy creating dioramas, but now more than ever, I love the challenge of bashing a figure. The improvements have all come from research that I do and through the help of this site and not the companies themselves. I do however think that your point is well shared by many here and I do understand your point.
 

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I personally don't think this hobby is all about accuracy! I like that companies give a handful of gear that can be optional in use.
I respectfully disagree with your first sentence here somewhat.

The thing is however, if I had been so inclined I would have purchased any of the figures OP mentioned and been just happy with them since I don't know that much about modern US equipment. However, I do know a few things more about WW2 German equipment, and if say DML would have equipped their 1939 Soldat 1 Peter Schmidt with a camo smock, I would have been just as annoyed as the OP regarding the modern equipment on the figures mentioned.

What I'm saying here is that if you know your stuff, inaccuracy is bad as hell, since its grating on your nerves and actual knowledge about the subject, be it a WW2 German soldier or a modern US pararescue jumper. Ignorance is hwever a helper here, and for most of us who lack the knowledge on how or when a certain piece of equipment was distributed, it becomes just something cool. And since most companies have their main markets in Asia, and I suspect Asians lack this knowledge just as much as I do, it will sell and people will be happy.

Which brings me to the second sentence in that quote: The more stuff included with a boxed figure the better, since it means you can equip the figure to your taste. IRL soldiers tend to remove as much stuff as possible, since stuff is heavy and they have to carry it around. But a 1/6 figure with that little equipment might look boring, but more accurate. But that is quite frankly up to the collector to decide: do I want a figure that looks realistic or one who packed everything including the kitchen sink? The former might look realistic, but the latter cooler. ¨

And that is not something to sneeze at.
 

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IMOK
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a
I respectfully disagree with your first sentence here somewhat.

The thing is however, if I had been so inclined I would have purchased any of the figures OP mentioned and been just happy with them since I don't know that much about modern US equipment. However, I do know a few things more about WW2 German equipment, and if say DML would have equipped their 1939 Soldat 1 Peter Schmidt with a camo smock, I would have been just as annoyed as the OP regarding the modern equipment on the figures mentioned.

What I'm saying here is that if you know your stuff, inaccuracy is bad as hell, since its grating on your nerves and actual knowledge about the subject, be it a WW2 German soldier or a modern US pararescue jumper. Ignorance is hwever a helper here, and for most of us who lack the knowledge on how or when a certain piece of equipment was distributed, it becomes just something cool. And since most companies have their main markets in Asia, and I suspect Asians lack this knowledge just as much as I do, it will sell and people will be happy.

Which brings me to the second sentence in that quote: The more stuff included with a boxed figure the better, since it means you can equip the figure to your taste. IRL soldiers tend to remove as much stuff as possible, since stuff is heavy and they have to carry it around. But a 1/6 figure with that little equipment might look boring, but more accurate. But that is quite frankly up to the collector to decide: do I want a figure that looks realistic or one who packed everything including the kitchen sink? The former might look realistic, but the latter cooler. ¨

And that is not something to sneeze at.
You said it... the difference in gear between the different eras are vast. Modern gear is more complex and the variety is huge. Having the accuracy in, lets say, a fire arm is important but mixing and matching of gear is present throughout the branches in our military especially in the higher specialized tiers. Its just a reality that was less of an issue in WWII. Can any company write 100% accurate and true on the side of their product?
 

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Say what?
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The very point when our brains store so much data that we can become dissatisfied with a figure because of inaccurate gear is the point at which the fun ceases and obsession begins.

At that point, why bother.

Obsession ain't no hobby.
 

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Resisting Evil
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Agreed.....except when it applies to time-frame.....to equip a figure set in a certain time-frame with gear that didn't yet exist in that time-frame is not obsessive.....it mirrors real life.......
 

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Taking over the World
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dadrab Re: Problem With Boxed Figures: Accuracy
The very point when our brains store so much data that we can become dissatisfied with a figure because of inaccurate gear is the point at which the fun ceases and obsession begins.

At that point, why bother.

Obsession ain't no hobby.
:agree I'm for accuracy in the items provided, but not to an obsessive extent. I was on my way there many years ago - - and it lost the fun of it. GI JOE was not accurate, but it was a gateway to this. Same goes for 21st Century who really revived this hobby.

I love the realism, the accuracy in the details, and the way it gets better and better, but at this point I've gone back to making it fun. Maybe 80% accurate and the rest "Hollywood" accurate. 100% enjoyable as a toy hobby.
 

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Hallo!

Apples and oranges, IMHO. Maybe a case of the Blind Men and the Elephant.

Meaning, "1:6" may be one Hobby, but it has different shapes and forms, and depths and degrees much like the parts of the elephant each blind man encounters and passionately defends as being what an elephant is like.

There are some few of us that are indeed History Heavy and Accuracy Based when it comes to "our' segment or niche corner of the Hobby.

So for some, the Devil is in the Details while for others God is in the Details. For me personally, when I pay $25 for a figure I have one set of expectations as to history and accuracy of uniform and kit. When I pay $100 or $150, I "expect" more than less.

One man's meat is another man's poison. I find my fun in the history and accuracy while other lads do not. I don't "obsess" about it, or over it. it is just part of the fun. Were it all not really relative, "we" would all still have only 1970's era G.I. Joes. Becasuse, G.I. Joes are fun too.

:) :)
 
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I buy boxed figures because they look pretty damn awesome in the promotional pics and that's about it; i don't see why accuracy should be a problem, just have fun; it's a hobby after all
 

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RodrigoViali
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Why is so fun collecting 1/6 ...where you need to work out to fill those gaps mentioned on the begin of the thread....:poke
 

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Resisting Evil
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Maybe the main issue is with one's definition of "accuracy".

Does it mean each piece is exactly 1:6 scale, with ultra fine details, and a perfect representation of the item in 1:6 scale?

Or does it mean the items that come with a given figure are not "accurate" (ie: a WWII rifle for a WWI figure) for that figure?
 

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I'm into accuracy because I'm trying to duplicate the prototype. I approach it more the way the kit model guys do. But I think the majority of people don't care that much, for whatever reason. I think the makers know this, so... they aren't going to kill themselves to make something perfect. I think it's partly economics and partly laziness. It's one thing to need to use other parts already created for monetary purposes. But when you start out fresh and just use one photo of something, and base the whole thing on that... I think that's laziness. There's been numerous releases over the last year or so, which were based on one photo... and in many cases, that one photo was not really representative of the overall thing being modeled. If it was my product, I'd put a lot more effort into it than that. But that's just me. I don;t expect every thread to be perfect. But when somebody makes a uniform brown, because they saw one photo... and the other 99% of those uniforms are actually green... I think that's kind of dumb.
 

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No more Pancake face
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Well its a good thing this hobby is so realistic that it allows you to break down and change things to what ever way you decide is best. Its also a good thing there is a huge loose market for this hobby as well. Something not being up to your standards of accuracy is the easiest "problem" in this hobby to fix and a large part of what keeps it interesting.


Side note:
Hot toys made some great military figures but they were by no means the shinning example of accuracy. Marines in Iraq wearing Desert tiger stripe? Marines with facial hair? Even when they finally got around to making MARPAT it looked horrible. But you know what? I am sure glad they made that desert tiger stripe uni because my MGSV Big Boss needs a set. I am also glade they made that Sniper with a goatee because its a great version of that dude from Prison break.
 

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Resisting Evil
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Marines in Iraq wearing Desert tiger stripe?
That's what I mean.....it's not "accurate" to equip Marines in Iraq with Tiger Stripe......but was the Tiger Stripe itself "accurate" ????
 

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I believe the companies try their best, when bumped up against cost. And cost will always win, because we're consumers, not Museum Curators.

You don't want a die-hard military guy running the show.."That selector switch is wrong! That color should be more brown! OMG I never had a sidearm when I was in-country!" etc, etc. That guy will never, ever ship a product....at some point decisions are made and boom, out the door a figure goes.

Most military vests look the same to me, just like kids backpacks. They're all different..and they're all pretty much the same, too. I wasn't in the service, so I'm going to care a lot less than those of you who wore this stuff in real-life, or had a relative or a photo that you are trying to re-create.

In the end, however, you have to remember: They're collectibles.......perfect is subjective.
Hot Toys had some good military releases, they had some iffy ones.....bad digital camo, oversized weapons, wrong equipment. But that's also creative license. Just because you've seen a dozen or two dozen photos, that is literally just a snapshot...maybe the company has another photo...or maybe they just made it up based on consultants information....

Do I want my 1991 Desert Storm SAS guy wearing a digital pattern or carrying an HK416? No. But I also know I'm buying a mass produced consumer product and if the vest isn't the right brand or style...so long as its not something from the distant future, you make compromises...
 
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