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Old 09-18-2008, 22:07
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U.S. Tier 1 Special Operations Forces Educational Thread

THE MATTER WHICH FOLLOWS MAY NOT BE ABSOLUTELY VALID OR CURRENT.
BEAR THAT IN MIND IF YOU CHOOSE TO USE IT FOR REFERENCE.



I've been seeing a lot of Figures out there ( not including the ones from those who intentionally disregard realism ) that just don't know enough about these two units and their gear to make a well received Figure.

So I've compiled this list of information that will help those who don't know anything about Navy Development Group & Army Delta Force make more realistic and overall, just cooler looking Figures

I'll start with a Unit that's never been more Secretive that it is now, for obvious Lime Light Stricken Reasons - Navy Special Warfare Development Group.

I wrote this a while ago, thanks to certain sources I don't want to spoil, and to the others I simply just cant tell you about, I'll provide My Summary of this Unit.

"Navy Special Warfare Development Group, (formerly known as MOB 6, SEAL Team Six, and MARESFAC) based in Dam Neck, Virginia, is responsible for U.S. Counter-Terrorist Operations in Maritime Environments. Once More has been Officially Announced by the Pentagon and DoD & S.D. to be an "Intentional Brother CT Squadron of Delta Force". Navy Special Warfare Development Group has as a primary function in intelligence, counter-intelligence, investigative, and national security work, and the provisions of Chapter 71 of title 5 of the United States Code cannot be applied to this organization in a manner consistent with national security requirements and considerations.

Which can be found and elaborately explained Here

Origin of DEVGRU can be traced to the aftermath of the failed 1980 attempted to rescue American hostages at the Iranian Embassy (Operation Eagle Claw). Prior to this, the SEALs had already begun CT training, including all 12 platoons in SEAL Team One on the West Coast. On the East Coast, however, elements of SEAL Team Two had taken the issue one step further. They formed a dedicated two-platoon group known as "Mob-Six" (short for Mobility Six) in anticipation of a Maritime Scenario Requiring a CT Response and had begun training (including the development of advanced tactics such as fast roping) to that end. As was the case with the U.S. Army's initial CT unit - Blue Light - and Delta Force, only one group was needed and could be recognized as Official. With the formal creation of SEAL Team Six (a name selected primarily to confuse Soviet intelligence as to the number of SEAL Teams in Operation) in October 1980, Mob-Six was demobilized. A large number of members, however, including the former Mob-Six Commander, were asked to join the fledgling group. With prior experience from these Operators, aggressive leadership, and an accelerated training program, SEAL Team Six was declared mission-ready just six months later.

Training for Six was conducted throughout the United States and abroad, both on military and civilian facilities. Exchange programs and joint trainings were expanded with the more experienced international teams such as Germany's GSG-9, Great Britain's Special Air Service (SAS). In all cases, emphasis was placed on realism in training, in accordance with the "Train as you Fight, Fight as you Train" philosophy popular amongst most of the world's leading Special Operations and CT units.

ST6 participated in a number of operations, both overt and covert, throughout the 1980's before being revamped and renamed. The reasons for this transformation are vague, however the primary factor cited has been the need for the unit to evolve out of a poor reputation of the group within the Navy such as Being Rogue Operators or "Loose Cannons" or Simply Undisciplined. Such is the same for the Delta Force.

A great deal of controversy was generated due to charges of misappropriation of funds and equipment by team members, as well as the conviction of unit founder Cdr. Richard Marcinko on charges of conspiracy, conflict of interest, making false claims against the government, and bribery. He was sentenced to nearly two years in a Federal penitentiary in addition to being forced to pay a $10,000 fine. Despite this turn of events, Marcinko is still revered in some SEAL circles as an almost mythical figure. This status was attained, in no small part, to a best selling-book series which centers around fictional maritime special operations and counterterrorism.

The US government has described Navy Special Warfare Development Group as having been established to oversee development of NSW tactics, equipment, and techniques. This, of course, is only partly true. The unit is under the direct command of NAVSPECWARGRU, however it is also a component of Joint Special Operations Command (JSOC - Pope AFB, North Carolina), along with other CT units such as Delta Force and the Air Forces 24th. It is believed that DEVGRU maintains its own helicopter support unit (2 Sqns. with 18 HH-60H for SEAL transport and support), but trains frequently with the 160th SOAR, especially in support of ship assaults, which frequently make use of the small MH-6 "Little Bird", operated exclusively by the 160th.

Organization and Manpower of the Group is a classified, and can only be guessed at. It is estimated that NSWDG now numbers (2007) approximately 200-400 Operators along with an approximate 300 Support Personell, broken down by Squadrons, much like the British SAS and Delta Force. Most recently, there are currently 4 such Cells within DEVGRU as Follows.

NSWDG Teams Consist of Cells, such as an Evasion and Recovery Cell (the new name for E&E is now E&R), a Force Protection Cell (military version of VIP Protection detail), a Sniper Cell, etc.

- Assault - Red : With a Native American Indian as Their Mascotte.

- Premier Assault - Gold
- Assault - Blue
- Transportation - Grey
- Recon and Surveillance - Black
- New Personnel In Training - Green

Along With Facility Locations Such as Follows

Major Component Commands

Naval Special Warfare Group 1, Coronado, Calif.
Naval Special Warfare Group 3, Coronado, Calif.
Naval Special Warfare Group 2, Little Creek, Va.
Naval Special Warfare Group 4, Dam Neck, Va.
Naval Special Warfare Operational Support Group, Coronado, Calif.

Naval Special Warfare Development Group is responsible for the testing, evaluation and development of technology and maritime, ground and airborne tactics applicable to NSW forces, along with The Department of Defense and The Pentagon Among Many Others.

There is also an Administrative and Training Facility which numbers approximately 200 personnel. These Individuals are responsible for the actual Testing, Creation and Development of New CT and NSW Equipment Including Weapons for and from The Entire Navy and Army, CT Tactics, and Training and Readiness of All Navy Special Forces Personnel.

Development Group is one of only Two US units authorized to conduct Pre-Emptive actions against Terrorists and Terrorist Cells (NOTE: Red Cell once shared this charter, although it was never put into practice before the unit was disbanded). SEALs Operatives reportedly fire an average of 2,500 to 3,000 rounds per week in training. The Code is here for you to look at and through : Link

NSWDG Train and Operate in JSOC With Delta Force Primarily, along with The German GSG-9 and British SAS along with the the Air Forces 24th ( Look into that Air Force Unit ).

Operations

1983 - SEAL Team Six members were also responsible for the rescue and evacuation of Governor Sir Paul Scoon from Grenada during Operation Urgent Fury. Other aspects of the operation included the securing of a radio transmitter which resulted in heavy contact with Grenadian forces.

1985 - Six deployed to the site of the Achille Lauro hijacking in anticipation of a possible assault on the vessel.

1989 - The unit took part in Operation Just Cause as part of Task Force White, which included SEAL Team Two. Their primary task, along with Delta Force, was the location and securing of Panamanian strongman Manuel Noriega.

1990 - They again operated in Panama as part of a secret operation code-named "Pokeweed" which had as its goal the apprehension of Colombian drug lord Pablo Escobar. Although Six was deployed from the US aircraft carrier USS Forrestal offshore, the mission was aborted before it even got started due to poor pre-assault intelligence.

1991 - SEAL Team Six reportedly recovered Haitian President Jean Bertrand Aristide under cover of darkness following the coup which deposed him.

1991 - Six was also part of contingency planning for the shooting down Saddam Hussein's personal helicopter with Stinger missiles, although this operation never got beyond the planning stage.

1993 - Development Group Squadron 4 ( SEAL Team Six ) Inserted Secretly with Delta Force durring the Somalia Mog. Conflict Using Newly Developed Suppressed M4's that The Actual NSWDG Teams Tested and Issued to Delta and Themselves prior to Country-Insertion. There is Little Known about the actual Operation and Purpose of Involvement But it's The Pentagon and D.O.D. along with the State Department That have tossed out information about a Single 4 Man Squad being Involved which is extremely likely.

1996 - The unit reportedly deployed to Atlanta, Georgia as part of a large US counterterrorist contingency plan for the 1996 Summer Olympics. (NOTE: The Federal Bureau of Investigation's and CIA's Hostage Rescue Teams are responsible for domestic CT and was the primary response unit).

2003 - Delta and SEAL Operators Formed a Task Force that ended up Rescuing Army PFC Jessica Lynch. Assaulting Force Comprised of Mostly Development Group Operators ( SEALs ), and also helped uncover 9 American Bodies buried by a Hospital.

Now onto Gear, Unit Familiarity

First I'll Post what are already Confirmed as Very Accurate Hits for Figures.

But First, I'm posting this before I lose all My information Etc. These Links and Pictures are Tricky.

Last edited by Stealth : 09-18-2008 at 23:02.
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Old 09-18-2008, 22:12
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Go man, Go!
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Old 09-18-2008, 22:13
Stealth's Avatar
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Dang, these pictures are not agreeing with Me - Give Me a Few Minutes, this will take a few days, that's how Many I have.
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Old 09-18-2008, 22:30
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http://img480.imageshack.us/img480/7...9206704ys3.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...D-00-00148.jpg - Delta & SEALs in Bosnia
http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/462/deltahk4ez9.jpg
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Old 09-18-2008, 22:33
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http://img390.imageshack.us/img390/6006/tag60tt3.jpg - Had to do this for OPSEC and PERSEC Reasons
http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/462/deltahk4ez9.jpg

I've got plenty more Coming of SAS, SEALs and Delta from many different Eras.
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Old 09-19-2008, 06:30
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Nice write up. Looking forward to seeing more pictures and reading more.
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Old 09-19-2008, 07:11
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Thread moved to appropriate forum.
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Old 09-19-2008, 17:47
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Very good information will always come in handy. Maybe you could also include their Garb and gear or special exclusive weapons they use if it is possible coz this is what the hobby is all about, Authenticity, the attention to detail. Thanks for sharing. Is it a silly thing to ask knowing we already see it in photos?
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Old 09-19-2008, 21:35
Stealth's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthBoz View Post
Nice write up. Looking forward to seeing more pictures and reading more.
Yes Yes, I've got roughly from 200 to 500 More Pics including The most accurate Figures I've seen to date, some of which you've all seen already I'm sure.
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Old 09-20-2008, 01:45
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http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/3...9202814pk6.jpg

Plenty more coming ....
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Old 09-26-2008, 20:41
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Seriously, I've got like 480 more pics of SAS, SEALs and Delta, damn hosting restrictions .... Feel free to post them if you guys can/want, I'll be able to tell you what Unit you're posting if you don't already know or can't tell the difference, or because someone else posted it and it says it's another unit Etc.
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Old 09-29-2008, 05:30
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Special Forces is a specific unit.
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Old 09-30-2008, 12:14
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Stealth,
here are a few pics for ya.
2,4,6,9and 10 are CAG; 5 are two Devgru operators KIA (RIP), 8 is a Devgru patch.
Others are unknown.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 145PPL.jpg (54.6 KB, 551 views)
File Type: jpg 3467539.jpg (55.9 KB, 430 views)
File Type: jpg CAG.jpg (66.4 KB, 343 views)
File Type: jpg CAG-hussein_small.jpg (422.2 KB, 493 views)
File Type: jpg DEVGRU KIA.jpg (71.9 KB, 435 views)
File Type: jpg deltadudeinMulticam18bd.jpg (76.0 KB, 335 views)
File Type: jpg groupblackout.jpg (117.7 KB, 385 views)
File Type: jpg Photo6892-1.jpg (24.8 KB, 179 views)
File Type: jpg Jim_in_Somalia-198x532.jpg (21.0 KB, 294 views)
File Type: jpg persec_chopper.jpg (218.3 KB, 479 views)

Last edited by CHRISTOPHE : 10-05-2008 at 16:06.
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Old 09-30-2008, 12:20
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And a few more.
1 CAG
2 Unknown
3 CAG KIA (RIP)
4 DEVGRU KIA (RIP)
5 DEVGRU KIA (RIP)
6 Supposedly early Seal Six
7 Unknown operator with HK 416
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 115mre.jpg (80.3 KB, 404 views)
File Type: jpg 1107473mx7.jpg (280.2 KB, 302 views)
File Type: jpg Delta bob.jpg (84.5 KB, 381 views)
File Type: jpg DEVGRUkiaJason%20Richard%20Freiwald.jpg (29.7 KB, 317 views)
File Type: jpg DEVGRUkiaJohn%20Wayne%20Marcum.jpg (41.8 KB, 288 views)
File Type: jpg Seal%20Team%206%20members.jpg (63.6 KB, 291 views)
File Type: jpg USSFhk416.jpg (119.1 KB, 371 views)

Last edited by CHRISTOPHE : 10-05-2008 at 16:12.
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Old 09-30-2008, 12:29
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Here is a pic of a Brit SBS vest (I believe 80s period).
Attached Images
File Type: jpg SBSmctvest.jpg (100.6 KB, 220 views)
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Old 09-30-2008, 13:24
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Two DEVGRU (first one is KIA-RIP) and two quite famous CAG warriors (now out of the unit):
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DEVGRUoperator.jpg (48.4 KB, 451 views)
File Type: jpg DEVGRU FROG II PATTERN.jpg (69.9 KB, 410 views)
File Type: jpg kyle1.jpg (19.2 KB, 638 views)
File Type: gif old_pic.gif (31.7 KB, 384 views)

Last edited by CHRISTOPHE : 10-05-2008 at 16:09.
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Old 09-30-2008, 13:41
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http://www.onesixthwarriors.com/foru...6&d=1222795215
This pic is of a Dyncorp PMC, it was apart of a gallery for a anti-drug mission in afghanistan and they came under fire.
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Old 09-30-2008, 15:17
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Thanks for the info. I took off the pic.
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Old 10-09-2008, 07:19
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nice pice!
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Old 12-06-2008, 14:41
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Awesome thread.

These are great photos to reference for projects.
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Old 01-03-2009, 09:32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stealth View Post
I've been seeing a lot of Figures out there ( not including the ones from those who intentionally disregard realism ) that just don't know enough about these two units and their gear to make a well received Figure.

So I've compiled this list of information that will help those who don't know anything about Navy Development Group .
Actually the TO&E you posted for DEVGRU is old, they've reorganized and expanded over the last few years. It, along with all the other Special Mission Units (SMU), is organized into "squadrons". The DEVGRU squadrons are called Naval Special Warfare Tactical Development and Evaluation Squadrons.
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Old 01-03-2009, 11:00
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Old 01-28-2009, 06:10
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Re: U.S. Tier 1 Special Operations Forces Educational Thread

Group guys?
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Old 01-30-2009, 05:51
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Re: U.S. Tier 1 Special Operations Forces Educational Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordstroem View Post
Group guys?
Could be. That's Kyle Lamb (Viking Tactics) in the center, so it's probably a class picture. One observation on that pic; most of those guys aren't running a vertical foregrip. Because of this common sense approach to their guns, I think they might actually be SF guys.

And because I am a stickler for accuracy, the title of this thread should be SOF Educational thread, not Special Forces. Special Forces, as noted earlier, is a specific unit, not a generic designation.

My .02
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Last edited by Steve O. : 01-30-2009 at 05:54. Reason: clarification
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Old 01-30-2009, 07:21
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Re: U.S. Tier 1 Special Operations Forces Educational Thread

Roger that sir, I guess the lack of 416's also may indicate
more towards Army SF than JSOC SMU's (though some
416's seem to be around in the Groups also) .
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Old 01-30-2009, 13:07
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Re: U.S. Tier 1 Special Operations Forces Educational Thread

Confirmed from VTAC webpage...guys from 10th SFG(A).
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Old 03-30-2009, 19:00
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Re: U.S. Tier 1 Special Operations Forces Educational Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by DSumner View Post
Actually the TO&E you posted for DEVGRU is old, they've reorganized and expanded over the last few years. It, along with all the other Special Mission Units (SMU), is organized into "squadrons". The DEVGRU squadrons are called Naval Special Warfare Tactical Development and Evaluation Squadrons.
No, that's just the BS name they give it when Department of Navy's Chief Announces their rare death.

Official Unit Name - Naval Special Warfare Development Group ( 1 - 4 ) Broken down into 4 Different Specialized Squadrons.
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Old 03-31-2009, 15:16
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Re: U.S. Tier 1 Special Operations Forces Educational Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stealth View Post
No, that's just the BS name they give it when Department of Navy's Chief Announces their rare death.

Official Unit Name - Naval Special Warfare Development Group ( 1 - 4 ) Broken down into 4 Different Specialized Squadrons.
Not sure where you're getting your info, but DEVGRU, the National Missions tasked parts of the 160th, Delta/CAG, ISA, etc. and other SMUs are organized into squadrons. DEVGRU activated a 5th squadron a couple of years back, as part of a reorganization and expansion.

As a side note, Delta, the 160th, DEVGRU and the 75th (alone with some other units) were all ordered to increase their capacity by roughly 1/3. They've all been on recruiting drives, trying to increase the number of operators. The 75th Ranger Regiment added a Ranger Special Troops Battalion, expanded its RRD to a full size Ranger Recon Company. Each Ranger Bn. added a fourth rifle company (Co. D.), a Ranger Support Company (Co. E), and a Recon platoon. They've also increased the number of Strykers they have available. They're currently considering consolidating the Regiment at one location, and reorganizing, by either permanently forward deploying small packages of Rangers, and having a permanent "Squadron" to support SMU taskings. The 160th's plan is to basically split into two units. One unit will support SMUs and the other would support "White" SOF missions.

Last edited by DSumner : 04-01-2009 at 08:00.
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Old 03-31-2009, 23:04
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Re: U.S. Tier 1 Special Operations Forces Educational Thread

Just a quick question here, Stealth. Where are you getting your information? In your first post, you reference some sources and post information that apparently aren't as current or accurate as they could be. The pics that you've posted all look like open source material, most of them archival (what is up with the HKMP5SD pic with the shooter's finger wrapped around the trigger?). You offer to critique other Members' bashes for accuracy, but you offer no credentials for doing so. Your profile only tells us that you like music. I'm pretty sure that, despite your moniker under your avater, you're not actually a SEAL. So, what is your history? What qualifies you to give guidance or critique on this subject?
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Last edited by Steve O. : 04-01-2009 at 07:32.
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